Episode 16- A Description and The Importance of SEO with Brandon Leibowitz

Today, we discuss the journey of Brandon Leibowitz! Thank you for joining our journey through the arts. Like we always say "Pursuing your Passions is a Bitch... But it's worth it!"

Please Check out our friend, Brandon Leibowitz-
SEO Optimizers- https://seooptimizers.com/brandon-leibowitz/

Also Check us out and our future projects at The Rogue Scientist Productions
Website- https://theroguescientistproductions.com/
Facebook- https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100087537946337
Instagram- https://www.instagram.com/roguescientistproductions/

Check out "The World Beyond" by Charles Dockham on Kindle Vella- https://www.amazon.com/kindle-vella/story/B0BMZPTP6G

Check out "The Beautiful Beast" by Carolyn Clark on Kindle Vella-https://www.amazon.com/kindle-vella/story/B0BVMNPBKZ

Check out Watsynthebox- Guest host William Thornhill- https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100094728966282&mibextid=b06tZ0

Transcript

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (00:02.875)
Thank you and welcome to pursuing your passions as a bitch. I am your host Charles Dockman, the owner of the Road Science Productions and author of The World Beyond, an ongoing story on Kindle Vella. With me, I have my guest host Brandon Lebowitz. Brandon?

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (00:19.91)
for having me on today.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (00:22.835)
Great. And so primarily what we're going to focus on today is what you actually do a lot, which is SEO optimization and everything along those ends. I'm really excited to kind of get this conversation started because it kind of it takes a completely different side of what people think of when promoting their projects, which is making sure their visibility is out there.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (00:53.738)
Brandon, what got you into kind of focusing on SEO and SEO optimization?

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (01:00.55)
Well, I just kind of fell into it after I graduated from college, got my degree in business marketing and the first job I got out of school was helping a company out with their digital marketing and it was back in 2007 and I didn't really know much about it. They said, don't worry, we don't know much either. We're going to learn with you and take you to classes, workshops, seminars and after working there for a few months, just kind of realized that digital marketing is probably the future. Everyone's probably going to have a website and there's a lot of ways to get traffic

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (01:13.879)
Mm-hmm.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (01:31.15)
email marketing and SEO and over the years just thought SEO is a way to get free traffic. So why spend money on paid ads if you could get up there for free and over the years worked at different advertising agencies as the director of SEO but before work or after work, when I'm on lunch breaks, I work on my own company and built that up to where I was able to eventually quit my job and focus solely on this and been doing that ever since.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (01:32.595)
Hmm.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (01:56.85)
Thanks for watching!

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (01:57.495)
Excuse me. No, that's actually great because, so I've freshly started getting into this platform in terms of building my website out, the Road Scientist Productions. And so one thing that I've started learning more about is SEO. And for one thing that I'd like to kind of say to our listeners, SEO stands for search engine optimization. Primarily, it's the focus on making sure

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (02:27.895)
project, your website, anything has the visibility that you're looking for, like page one of Google. So that's a huge piece to kind of know, especially when you start putting out your stories. Kindle has a specific SEO in terms of how they kind of look at things, what they're looking for in terms of likes, anything along those ends to make sure that your story is at the top of

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (02:57.615)
and Leibowitz reached out to me in terms of wanting to be on the podcast because this is something that I've been wanting to talk about. So one thing that I wanted to ask you Brandon, so do you suggest for websites organic SEO where you're just kind of pushing out more content, more articles, more anything along that end or do you focus a lot on keywords and making

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (03:27.495)
Every page has a specific keyword, so that way it's drawing in that.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (03:33.15)
No, you got to do it all. If you just do one thing, it's not going to get you rankings. If you just go in and put keywords all over your website, Google's not going to rank you because they just don't believe that you are who you say you are. And if you only go out and build backlinks to build trust up to get Google to trust you, then Google's going to trust you. But if you don't have the keywords in the right places, Google's not going to know what keywords to rank you for. So you have to make sure that you do everything. You can't just do one thing or a few things because it's not going to get the full results. It's like a puzzle with SEO.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (04:03.15)
pieces together, but some pieces are a lot bigger than others, like backlinks. It's a very, very big part of it. Content, very, very big part of it. But before that, you always want to start off researching keywords to find out what keywords has high search volume, that way you can incorporate the correct keywords into your website and not have to go backwards and make all these changes and then realize that you put the wrong keywords in there. So using tools like the Google Keyword Planner, it's a free tool from Google. It'll show you how many people search for your keyword every single month so you

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (04:03.581)
Mm-hmm.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (04:32.195)
Mm-hmm.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (04:33.23)
out is this a good keyword or is this a bad one or should I use a plural or a synonym or a variation of that that's gonna get me more search volume but also buyer intent you know I'll just target any keyword while I make sure there's intent behind it not just targeting keywords that have high search volume but have high search volume with buyer intent behind it because traffic is traffic if you're just getting traffic from keywords that don't have intent behind it while those people are just gonna hit that back and like if you're

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (05:03.47)
Or and then you try and make the word shoes. That's really broad and generic. And a lot of people are going to go there. But most of those people are probably going to look, aren't looking for tennis shoes or in me rank for the word tennis shoes. That's just so broad and generic versus a keyword like men's tennis shoes, color blue, size 10. Like it's a very long keyword. Not many people are searching for it, but the people searching for it know what size, what color, what style they're ready to make a purchase. So going after those longer tail keywords,

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (05:30.237)
Hmm

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (05:33.15)
what it's called is anything with two or more words. It's gonna have less search volume but more buyer intent behind it.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (05:37.558)
Mm-hmm.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (05:41.895)
So for, like, I know a lot of the aspects that we've kind of been focused on, especially in the industries that we've kind of been in, which is for authors, writers, for video production and all those ends, what would you suggest for anybody getting started in creating like their author sites or anything like that to really kind of promote themselves? What would you kind of suggest for those people getting started to focus on?

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (06:11.956)
in terms of keywords.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (06:15.55)
You would want to find long tail keywords, so keywords that are two or more words, and use a Google Keyword Planner to search for keywords that are relevant. And you just really need to put like one or two keywords in there and it'll show you hundreds, thousands of variations of that keyword. So you could pick a choose and see which ones are relevant and incorporate those into your website.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (06:20.137)
Okay.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (06:37.575)
Oh, great. And just to kind of go over a little bit more, I know that kind of includes, you said backlinks, and would you be able to explain what backlinks are to our listeners?

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (06:49.85)
Backlinks are what ranks websites. So Google's whole algorithm started based off backlinks and it's still heavily based off backlinks to this day. And a backlink is a clickable link from another website that points to yours. So if you're reading an article in the latimes.com and in there it says Brandon Leibowitz and you click on that, then I'd be getting a backlink from the latimes.com. So the more websites that talk about you, the more trust Google's gonna give to you. And then they look at those keywords on your website. But it doesn't work the other way around.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (07:20.475)
it's pretty much impossible to rank on Google.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (07:25.082)
Oh, really?

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (07:27.53)
Yep, that's how Google's algorithm starts. It's all based off backlinks. Backlinks are what rank websites. Without backlinks, we're not gonna get Google to trust you. Google's not gonna rank website that they don't trust.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (07:39.695)
Oh, okay. So that's really important, I guess, for anybody starting out, just because I know that, for me, I'm learning everything that kind of goes, as I'm coming along, and I learned a little bit about backlinks, and which is making sure I'm connecting with other websites, and making sure I'm partnering with them to create a portfolio of a network of people. But for some listeners who might be starting out, especially when you're creating your own websites,

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (07:45.55)
Thanks for watching!

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (08:09.495)
create a website for you, it might not always be explained to you that that's an important process or an important piece in terms of being for Google to kind of put you higher up on the mark, especially in terms of page recognition and in terms of everything else. So one thing that I learned when I was kind of looking things up and starting to learn

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (08:40.015)
social media and so or that those links when people are promoting you on social media that those are viewed as less reliable or less important compared to if you're being linked through a completely separate website. Could you explain that a little bit more?

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (08:56.35)
So with the backlinks, it's all about relevancy. Google wants sites that are related to what you're doing. So if you're getting a bunch of social media sites linking out to you, then Google's going to think you're a social media site, which if that's what you're doing, then that's the type of sites that you want linking out to you. But it's all about relevancy. You need sites that are related to what you're doing. So if you're selling tennis shoes, then you need sites related to fashion, the shoes, clothing, and somewhat related to what you're doing. So it's all about relevancy.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (09:26.45)
too easy to get a backlink. It's not really going to count for SEO. Anywhere where it just says Azure link, like all those sites are blocked from Google. So Google can't really see those backlinks. They see that you have a presence in a profile, but they don't count for SEO. So you have to go for quality backlinks. And a quality backlink is a website that's related to what you're doing and authoritative. Those are the two main things. Relevancy is the most important thing. Going after Facebook is going to get to

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (09:36.705)
Mm-hmm.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (09:56.89)
If that's not what you're doing, you don't want those sites. And even if it is what you're doing, Google's blocked from those sites so they're not even gonna see those backlinks. So they're not gonna help you out. You need sites that are really to what you're doing. And the way to get those is by looking at your competitors' backlinks. So there's tools like Ahrefs or Moz or SEMrush where you go into Google, look for your keywords, use on that first page of Google, take those websites, throw it into those tools, and you'll see all of their backlinks. Because if they're on that first page of Google, it's more than likely because of those backlinks.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (10:26.652)
That will get Google to trust you in a similar way.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (10:32.275)
Okay, and that's actually something I never knew, is that not only are social media backlinks less important, but that I didn't know that Doodle didn't even see them, that they're not being shown to Doodle.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (10:46.73)
We have other competitors. So Facebook compete with Google, give them all the data. So we're not going to show that information. The only one that Google has access to is Facebook or YouTube, because Google owns YouTube and Twitter, Google partnered with Twitter like five years ago, so they could see their tweets. But other than that, they're pretty much blocked from all social

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (10:50.4)
Oh.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (11:02.402)
Mm-hmm.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (11:09.795)
Oh, okay. No, that's really good to know, especially when I know that a lot of the people that I'm trying to help out, especially when it comes to this platform, is anybody getting into the entertainment industry and making sure that they're more visible and when they're trying to promote themselves, I know a lot of people trying to take those steps by focusing a lot on social media marketing. What would you say is very important

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (11:39.935)
anybody kind of getting started to try and connect the two is would you say social media marketing is just as important as making sure that all this because it almost seems separate by the way that you're describing it is that yes you are marketing yourself social media wise but SEO is a completely separate beast.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (11:56.15)
Thanks for watching!

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (12:01.09)
Yep, they're separate, but they help one another out, but they're not going to directly help another out. Like SEO is great. You get traffic to your website and then social media people see it's like social proof that builds trust up. So people trust you more because people go to the website, they don't just instantly trust you. So they want to see reviews, testimonials. They want to see status updates. I want to see that's your real business that you have followers that you engage with them. So social is great depending on what type of business like myself or like service

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (12:06.661)
Yeah.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (12:31.05)
doctors, lawyers, and just probably not going to get much traction off social. Not many people are going to look for a dentist on Facebook or Instagram. Some people might, but the majority of people are probably going to go on Google. And then after they go on Google, they're going to check them out on social for social proof to make sure they're trustworthy, real businesses, credible. But if you're selling products, then social probably would be a great spot. Especially if you're selling something new that no one's ever heard of. Because if I'm not searching on Google, then there's not much you can do with

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (13:01.15)
build that awareness and social is a great way but it's about just knowing who your audience is and how do I get in front of them at the right moments. That's all that matters with SEO and digital I mean.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (13:11.975)
Okay, and would you suggest as you're kind of growing, I know Google ads kind of, it pushes the SEO by forcing your website link to be higher up on the page piece, or at least that's what I understand about it, is that when you pay for Google ads, you're paying to be higher up on page when you're being searched for certain keywords, like video production or anything like that,

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (13:21.05)
Thanks.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (13:41.215)
because you're a part of an ad platform, would you suggest that's important for a small business growing when they don't have the SEO or traffic behind their page as they're kind of getting started?

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (13:54.49)
And paid ads work, but it's just about knowing who you're, well, making sure that you make a positive return on ad spend. That's the biggest thing is making sure that you put more money in than you're getting out, or that you're getting more money than you're putting in. But as long as you're just making a positive return on ad spend, then I would continue running paid ads. It doesn't hurt. It's just making sure that you're making more than you're putting in. That's the biggest thing. And also testing, going in different platforms and trying out Google ads. You could try out banner ads with Google, YouTube ads. You could do Gmail ads.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (14:02.68)
Yeah.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (14:24.63)
Social ads if you wanted to try those out as well, but it's all about just testing saying where your audience is and how to How to get them to engage with you the ads do work for the short term long term SEOs better play but short term as he paid ads work because SEO does take about six months on average It's not more or less depending on how those keywords are. But if you want paid ads you get immediate results So just depending on where you are in that status of your business And if you want immediate results paid ads

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (14:36.621)
Mm-hmm.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (14:54.25)
term SEO is going to be much better because if you stop spending money on paid ads you just disappear. With SEO, if you stop doing SEO you're not just going to disappear. Over time your competitors are going to do more SEO than you've done but that's going to take them time to do that so it's not going to be instantaneous where you drop off.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (15:13.215)
Okay. And so I know that from paying for ads, you're able to focus on a certain area or like a, I guess, geo area where if you're saying I'm a video production company, you don't want the video production company or you to be shown to the US, you want it to be shown for, I guess, because I'm in New Hampshire, local New Hampshire, people who are looking for this information. So how do you

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (15:45.415)
I'm trying to think of how I'm trying to say, how do you focus your SEO to be very geographically focused? How do you focus that? If that makes sense.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (16:00.35)
Yeah, if you're a local business and you want to have a presence on like Google Maps, Apple Maps, Bing Maps, Yellow Pages, MapQuest, and all these local websites. So if you're a local business, then you want to try to focus on local search and just make sure you get exposure on the maps. And the yeah, that way people that are searching locally, they'll find you when you pop up. So making sure that you have a presence on all those platforms, make sure all your information is accurate.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (16:30.51)
the more trust Google is going to get to you and the higher they are ranking on Google Maps. So getting on hundreds of other map sites, that's going to get you right on Google Maps.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (16:41.616)
Oh wow, that's really interesting.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (16:47.695)
Okay, and so what do you focus on primarily? I know that you said that you work with SEO optimizers, but what is your overall job, I guess?

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (16:57.65)
Thank you.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (17:04.41)
My job is to help people get more sales and leads for their website. And that's where I help out with SEO. Also help out with a little bit of paid ads, just to help keep yourself top of mind, because unfortunately, half the people that come to your website are probably gonna hit that back button. So keep yourself top of mind. And the way to do that is having multiple touch points with social or paid ads or email marketing or any way to keep yourself top of mind. So just trying to make sure that your visitors stay and convert and not just leave your website

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (17:09.28)
Yep.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (17:34.85)
Unfortunately, most visitors leave and that's where you just gotta somehow figure out how do I get them to become a conversion, a sale, a leave versus just a visitor to my website or a social media follower.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (17:50.402)
And do you help a lot with the design of the website too?

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (17:55.03)
No, I don't do any building websites, just marketing them. So making sure that once you have a website that people find you, but building them is a whole another. Yeah. Strategy or learning coding is a little tricky. So I focus more on the organic, the traffic side of things.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (18:02.495)
Okay.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (18:13.295)
Yeah, I tried learning how to do WordPress and learning how to do all that. And then I just found Squarespace and it's just dried and dropped. So that's how I've been able to focus on that because just learning HTML and learning CSS is not a fun thing, especially once you get into the security side, I completely understand. Yeah, but in terms,

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (18:36.092)
Yeah.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (18:39.19)
Yeah, it gets a little complicated, so...

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (18:43.195)
Yeah, no, it does. And especially when you start learning about the security portion of it, you just kind of want somebody else to handle that portion because you don't want to be in trouble security stuff. So in terms of marketing and stuff, so I know that it's important to first off rank for your name. You want people to be able to find you for the road, like in my case, the road scientist productions,

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (19:12.45)
Thanks for watching!

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (19:13.195)
you for that. So how do you focus the website to also be able to be focused in, I guess, for podcast or anything along those ends, because I'm also writing a book. So author, how do you get that website to appear in those searches too?

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (19:35.85)
You just gotta put those keywords on your website. So if you're trying to make for podcasts and you have to have some content or pages about podcasting or whatever it is that you're promoting, you need to make sure you have pages about those because if you have pages on your website about that, then Google is not gonna know that you're trying to target those keywords. And then once you have those pages, then you have to build backlinks to build trust up. That way Google trusts you. So just building those pages isn't gonna do much without those backlinks in conjunction with it. It's like that puzzle

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (19:45.657)
Mm-hmm.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (19:52.617)
Okay.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (20:06.09)
There's a lot of pieces to this puzzle, but you got to put them all together. If you just create a page and Google is going to find you, they're probably not going to, if you're just building backlinks without those keywords, then Google is going to probably find you, but not know what keywords you're targeting. So just got to make sure that everything's in place. That way Google knows exactly what you're doing and how to rank you for their appropriate keywords that we get the right traffic.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (20:29.795)
Okay, and like I said, this is a great conversation because I know I'm focusing a lot on my website and how to do that, but I know anybody getting started, I was just talking to a couple people in terms of what they should do for their author website. And I know that at this point, people are spending money, thousands of dollars to get their page out almost immediately by either their name or their book name.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (21:01.456)
It's important to have a website for your book, and it's important to have a website for as you're an author, but to how to really get that information out and make sure that you're appearing in more places, so that way you get more traffic for your stories and you get more traffic for your books is very important, especially as an actor, director, video production.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (21:30.055)
today because I know that this is an aspect for small business owners and people getting started that Probably is just not really thought about because you think of everything else

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (21:48.795)
And one thing that I kind of wanted to learn a bit more about search engine optimization, I know that Google is very important, but is it different with Bing? Is it different with Yahoo? Is it different with those ones as well?

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (21:59.15)
Thanks for watching!

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (22:04.23)
Yeah, every search engine is gonna be a little different. Bing owns Yahoo, but when you search on Yahoo, it's not really Yahoo anymore. Bing is actually powering the search results. So you optimize for Google and Bing that covers the big three, but there's DuckDuckGo and all these other new ones that are emerging and they're all different ones because they're all kept top secret. They don't want each other to know how they work and nowadays it's like machine learning and AI. They just they don't even know how they work themselves like Google. It's just like we know some of it,

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (22:33.89)
itself and we're just trying to figure it all out. But they're all going to be for the most part pretty similar, but little things are going to be different. And that's where it's all about testing and just saying what works for each search engine.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (22:45.645)
Okay.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (22:48.395)
What would you suggest for new business owners to not just focus on Google or would you suggest them to focus on just Google for now?

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (22:57.05)
You just need to focus on where your audience is at. So it doesn't matter if they're on Google, if they're on different platforms, and you need to focus on a different platform, but you just need to be in front of your audience. That's really what matters with marketing is, who is your audience, where are they, and how do I get in front of them? And most people use Google, but if you're in another country, or maybe for some reason, your audience is using a different search engine, then you wanna make sure you optimize for that. And that's where you could check like Google Analytics and tools like that to see where my traffic's coming from and make sure that you optimize for those platforms.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (23:01.102)
Yep.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (23:29.035)
Great. Would you think, or can you think of any other questions that I might not have touched upon or anything that I might not have mentioned that might be very useful to any of our listeners?

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (23:46.15)
I would just say be patient with it all. It all takes time. SEO is not immediate, but as long as you keep doing the right things and sending Google the right signals, then they're going to start promoting you and moving up those rankings, but it all takes time. So just be patient with it. Don't expect immediate results. But as long as you keep working at it, you'll see yourself moving up those rankings.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (24:07.315)
Thank you so much. And I know that we're kind of coming towards the end of our show right now. I want to thank you for coming up on our show or coming to our show because this kind of gives a level of professionalism to the SEO portion that we try to talk about when it comes to marketing. And it kind of answers some of the questions I think more directly in terms of what our listeners would wanna hear. And I wanna really thank you for being on our show

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (24:37.836)
Are there any projects or anything that you would want our listeners to follow you on or reach out to you on? Thanks for listening. I'm going to go ahead and turn this off. I'm going to go ahead and turn

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (24:41.65)
Thanks for watching!

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (24:46.01)
I'd say if they want to learn more then I create a special gift for everybody. They go to my website at SEOoptimizers.com. That's SEOoptimizers.com forward slash gift. They can find that there along with my contact information and a bunch of classes I've done over the years. They could watch those for free. And also if they want to book some time on my calendar for an SEO analysis, I'm happy to check out their website for free and let them know what's working or what's not working and they could book some time on my calendar for.

brandon_leibowitz__seo_optimizers-08 (25:16.134)
there as well.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (25:20.535)
Great. And as for me, you will be able to find us on our website, the road scientist productions dot com, where we have merchandise and links to my story on Kindle Vella, the world beyond. You also have all of our road scientists production, social media platforms, Facebook, Twitter, YouTube. The best way to support us is to like our podcast on your favorite podcast platform of choice and let others know how much you've enjoyed our show. We want to thank you, Brandon, for being our guest on the show.

the_rogue_scientist_productions-3wdx (25:50.515)
today and thank all of our listeners for joining us as well. This has been our podcast to all of those out there looking to start a new career in the arts, such as acting, writing music, comedy, and more. Always remember pursuing your passions is a bitch, but it's worth it. Thank you.